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anarchovegan
replied 2145d
Why do I need to leave society instead of simply not being stolen from?
How does that follow?

replied 2145d
Living in an area that is taxed means to receive the services of those taxes. If you dont contribute that makes you a leech on society. It isn't morally horrible, but it is wrong.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d
Are you receiving a service if you cannot cancel the service?

replied 2145d
Part of the service is the stability of the area. This is why canceling the service requires leaving the area. Taxes are part of the community agreement. One can change that agreement.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d
How does systematic theft make any area stable? How does the government own land/area without any homesteading? How is being stolen from part of any agreement?
replied 2145d
Also people could work collectively to change taxation. I've said elsewhere that I prefer a sales tax over an income tax.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d
I am. I'm working to eliminate it by eliminating the defense of taxation, such as what you're exemplifying. I prefer zero systematic theft.
replied 2145d
People elect representatives who makes these rules. People continue to elect the representatives, which is a type of communal agreement.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d
Aren't those who do not wish to participate in being represented in the systematic theft included against their will?
replied 2145d
It is just a higher level of small community order. People tend to reject those who dont contribute to the group.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d
Yes; that's why I and many others reject government, which provides nothing, and only exists by theft.
replied 2144d
Except it is payment for services rendered, not theft.
anarchovegan
replied 2144d
I can cancel my Netflix subscription.
I can't cancel my government "subscription".
I can't fire them.
How is it a service if I can't fire them?
That's why I call it theft.
replied 2144d
The stable area is a significant part of the service. This is why canceling the service requires you leaving. Staying is opting in. You must opt out.
replied 2133d
"stable area" is so far removed from the myriad of entitlements the gov redistributes. many people would be happy paying just for that. dont want all the crap gov dreams up.
anarchovegan
replied 2142d
I don't think running away from the cancer of people advocating systematic theft is moral.
So I don't. How does my staying here validate my being stolen from?
replied 2145d
It's a grey area at best. You can leave. People want to stay and benefit from society without anyone paying for the public systems that give the area stability.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d
I don't see why I should leave and let the bullying and systematic theft that I find morally reprehensible continue.
Why shouldn't the government leave? Public systems are stable?
replied 2144d
The people want the government. So the few who dont should leave and create their own communities.
anarchovegan
replied 2144d
https://www.fsp.org/
https://www.freesociety.com
replied 2144d
There you go.
anarchovegan
replied 2142d
anarchovegan
replied 2144d
Could you define "the people"? If I and others who do not want government are part of "the people", then that statement is false.
replied 2144d
The people is a collective average of the population. You are part of the people. Your wishes make up a small proportion of the wishes of the population.
anarchovegan
replied 2142d
Especially without regard for consent, using a collective average of the population, lack of consensus becomes not only inevitable, but systematic; it will never go away - it can't.
replied 2141d
This isn't always true though. Some refuse to vote out of anger. Sadly they dont know the way their apathy is viewed.
anarchovegan
replied 2140d
How isn't it always true? Isn't consensus 100%? I clarify that that's what I mean.
You don't? You're advocating rule of majority over minority?
replied 2140d
Consensus isn't 100%. I do believe in the majority ruling over the minority, with some rules protecting that minority. As we have now.
anarchovegan
replied 2140d
Why do you believe in the majority ruling over the minority?
You're actually advocating a form of slavery?
replied 2140d
No, I am advocating a form of consensus. Also, as I said with rules protecting the minority. This is why we have rights and protections for minority groups.
anarchovegan
replied 2139d
What form of consensus? What does it look like?
If the minority is included without their consent, what do the rules "protecting" them matter?
How isn't that baseless lip-service?
replied 2139d
Majority consensus. The minority has their say, and isn't revealed to be the minority until after. The protections are real and significant. Ut has allowed the minority to grow.
anarchovegan
replied 2134d
Except that the minority can't dissassociate. Right?
Can't just not be stolen from. Correct?
replied 2141d
In democracy no vote is seen as a vote. A vote for the status quo. Most people vote when they are unhappy with the system. So theoretically low voter turn out is approval of the system
replied 2133d
I see no vote as vote of no confidence. imagine starting a gov, you & 1000 ppl go off into a room & vote for a gov then tell the 100M other ppl you now rule them bc they didnt vote no.
anarchovegan
replied 2140d
You're going to ignore my and others' overt disapproval of the system and not voting that we are openly and loudly saying?
Nothing theoretical here. I don't approve.
replied 2145d
The services provided create the stability. Law enforcement, justice system, military. They provide stability, most obvious during an emergency. Water and waste and such help as well.
anarchovegan
replied 2145d